Informational Nonconformances and Defects - Operator Error, System Error, or both?

In the event of a NC or defect, what/who is at fault?

  • "The system" is always at fault.

    Votes: 8 13.3%
  • "The system" is at fault ~ 90-96% of the time.

    Votes: 19 31.7%
  • "The system ~ 80%", operator ~ 20%.

    Votes: 21 35.0%
  • It's about even.

    Votes: 12 20.0%

  • Total voters
    60
  • Poll closed .

CCaantley

Involved In Discussions
Phew! I'd hate to think they were on the streets telling their story...

It takes something a lot worse for a hired in employee to be let go here. Stealing a large box of scrap and drugged up on the job were the last ones I heard about.
 

CCaantley

Involved In Discussions
FWIW, that depends on how you (or perhaps your customer) determines it.

It was 10K parts...but it was one order and one shipment and one error. Just sayin'...if you're gonna mess up, mess up BIG ;)

We were on this customer's radar before for other issues and had recently got back under. The plant we sent the wrong parts to wasn't too upset, but the parent company got us back on the radar. I keep track of internal and external PPM daily, and this one incident killed our external for the year :crybaby:
 

Ninja

Looking for Reality
Trusted Information Resource
but the parent company got us back on the radar

Yup...know that one..."automotive" and "on the radar" is a very bad thing. Somewhat understandable how upset upper mgmt might get, though still misplaced if it ends up with "blame this guy" and nothing else.

If you're going to get "on the radar" with auto...it should be for charging too much and making too much money from them. At least then it might be worth it.
 

Jim Wynne

Leader
Admin
We were on this customer's radar before for other issues and had recently got back under. The plant we sent the wrong parts to wasn't too upset, but the parent company got us back on the radar. I keep track of internal and external PPM daily, and this one incident killed our external for the year :crybaby:
By whose measurement of PPM? As Ninja suggested, taking a 10,000-piece PPM hit doesn't make much sense, especially in view of the fact that the whole PPM concept makes no sense.
 

CCaantley

Involved In Discussions
Yup...know that one..."automotive" and "on the radar" is a very bad thing. Somewhat understandable how upset upper mgmt might get, though still misplaced if it ends up with "blame this guy" and nothing else.

If you're going to get "on the radar" with auto...it should be for charging too much and making too much money from them. At least then it might be worth it.

On the bright side, it wasn't automotive :)

By whose measurement of PPM? As Ninja suggested, taking a 10,000-piece PPM hit doesn't make much sense, especially in view of the fact that the whole PPM concept makes no sense.

I'm still pretty new to the quality field. Keeping track of PPM internally and externally is one of the things my predecessors did. Upper management wants that to continue, so I keep it up.
 

Jim Wynne

Leader
Admin
I'm still pretty new to the quality field. Keeping track of PPM internally and externally is one of the things my predecessors did. Upper management wants that to continue, so I keep it up.

It's unavoidable these days, but the point was that you might want to revisit classification. You shouldn't be counting it as 10,000 bad parts; it was one bad shipment.
 
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