Quality is everybody's responsibility

jmech · Sep 17, 2021

Jim Wynne said:
No is saying or suggesting that all top managers are "very dumb" and have "no understanding of risk." There are enough of them though, to keep this forum going strong for all these years.

Sidney Vianna said:
Top management will always seek short term financial results/gratification.

"Always" means that it is "all top managers". Choosing to "always seek short term financial results/gratification" by choosing to always ship nonconforming product assumes that "all top managers are "very dumb" and have "no understanding of risk."".

Or is there some scenario where it is "very smart" and "based on a good understanding of risk" for top managers to "always seek short term financial results/gratification" by choosing to always ship nonconforming product?

outdoorsNW · Sep 17, 2021

One problem is that many MBA programs neglect quality. Someone I know who was a quality manager and has an MBA said she was shocked at how little quality was discussed, even as a way of cutting costs other other topics that finance people typically care about. Her conversations and my conversations with people who got MBAs at multiple places seem to show the problem is widespread.

Sidney Vianna · Sep 17, 2021

outdoorsNW said:
One problem is that many MBA programs neglect quality. Someone I know who was a quality manager and has an MBA said she was shocked at how little quality was discussed, even as a way of cutting costs other other topics that finance people typically care about. Her conversations and my conversations with people who got MBAs at multiple places seem to show the problem is widespread.

Why do most companies have Quality reporting to Engineering or Operations and not to CEO?

normhowe · Sep 22, 2021

Sidney Vianna said:
Why do most companies have Quality reporting to Engineering or Operations and not to CEO?

Pharma and med devices have separation of church and state: Q. and Ops. report separately to top management.

normhowe · Sep 22, 2021

Sidney Vianna said:
While I wholeheartedly agree that we should assist top management in realizing the total cost of decisions, most organizations have no idea of accounting for the cost of non-quality; even ISO's attempt in creating an ISO Guidance Standard on the subject, ISO 10014:2021 - Quality management systems — Managing an organization for quality results — Guidance for realizing financial and economic benefits is a pathetic document. On top of that, most quality professionals out there are not really conversant in business financials. In the real world, as Jim stated the "when in doubt, ship it out" motto prevails. Top management will always seek short term financial results/gratification.

Quality has to view that a primary component of their job is to explain the total impact process errors to management. This means that they need to understand the cost reports both literally AND fundamentally. By that I mean both nominal and real costs of errors. When I was a plant mgr I knew that the visible cost report for a batch that had to be reworked was only the tip of the iceberg. So many costs are buried in allocations and overhead.

Where is the cost of purchasing trying to expedite emergency shipments of raw materials? What about that sales rep trying to explain to the customer why the shipment is delayed? You can go on and on. These are the parts of the iceberg that ripped open the Titanic. Quality needs to be able to understand them and be able to explain them to management. This isn't rocket science. I understood it; anybody can. If your top mgt can't or won't understand it, get into a lifeboat!

Mike S. · Sep 23, 2021

Calculating the true "cost of non-quality" is, IMO, impossible. The number can be ballparked but is unknown and unknowable. And, again IMO, the costs usually calculated formally or informally are much lower than reality.

Also, I think there are too many in management who do not consider ethics in the decision at all. Would you knowingly ship NC product if you knew it couldn't be traced to you or your company? (A thought question. Not asking anyone to answer that publicly.)

normhowe · Sep 23, 2021

Mike S. said:
Calculating the true "cost of non-quality" is, IMO, impossible. The number can be ballparked but is unknown and unknowable. And, again IMO, the costs usually calculated formally or informally are much lower than reality.

Agree completely. But most of the time you can quickly get an estimate that is accurate enough to allow you to make a decision. As a manager, that's all I need to know. Is this quality problem big enough to warrant the effort to drive a stake through its heart so it never arises again.

Jen Kirley · Sep 23, 2021

Costs of poor quality that are hard to calculate are often so because they are qualitative, not quantitative. Efficiencies that lower frustration are also valuable. They can be quantified by asking people, by surveys or during internal audits (why not?), during Management by Walking Around, during periodic employee evaluations (again, why not?) and so on.

It is true that many managers are not interested in this. I don't think it gets much focus in MBA programs. I is the sort of thing that separates the managers from the leaders.

John Broomfield · Sep 24, 2021

To estimate the price of nonconformity close enough to inspire preventive action or corrective action develop and use the formula agreed with top management.

Do not allow perfection to become the enemy of the good.

Note:

It is PRICE if we choose to pay by not taking action to remove root causes from the system

Johnnymo62 · Sep 24, 2021

My experience is that only one person owns something. If the top execute doesn't understand the value of "quality" for cost savings, customer satisfaction and improvement they will not demand quality of the organization. The top executive should ensure the management teams are using the QMS effectively to gain the most benefits. The top executive's attitude about quality and adherence to the QMS trickles down to everyone.

Quality is everybody's responsibility

jmech

outdoorsNW

Quite Involved in Discussions

Sidney Vianna

Post Responsibly

normhowe

Involved In Discussions

normhowe

Involved In Discussions

Mike S.

Happy to be Alive

normhowe

Involved In Discussions

Jen Kirley

Quality and Auditing Expert

John Broomfield

Johnnymo62

Haste Makes Waste

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