Continual decline of ASQ - can it be saved? Nov 2019

Sidney Vianna

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All organizations (for-profit, non-profit, government) come to the same bad end, which is serving the organization itself, rather than whatever mission they started out to serve.
I work for an organization that has been in business for 155 years. Lloyds Register has been in business for over 250 years. For organizations to endure the test of time and technological developments, they have to have a propensity and corporate culture to adapt to a changing business and societal context on a continual basis, but, at the same time, have a timeless purpose; otherwise, it's raison d'etre ceases to exist. It also helps the fact that lack of owners and shareholders allow an organization to manage and protect it's financial assets to ride business downturns out.
 

Ronen E

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All organizations (for-profit, non-profit, government) come to the same bad end, which is serving the organization itself, rather than whatever mission they started out to serve.
I'm even more cynical than that. I think that in most cases stated missions which don't revolve around serving the organisation itself are lip service in the first place, or a fantasy. Individuals can have non-selfish motives (not that common either), but a group of people is less likely to consistently follow the same non-selfish motives for a long period, and when the org becomes big it's practically impossible.

On the other hand, when an org is based on members, isn't serving the members' needs serving the org itself?
 

Sidney Vianna

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What do you mean by that? Aren't there always some owners or shareholders?
Ok. I should have been clearer. Without a typical owner. The ultimate ownership of DNV GL rests with a Foundation. All the profits are re-invested into the organization. DNV GL also has a policy of investing 5% of it’s annual revenue in R&D. For 2018, it means approximately US$ 125,000,000.00 were allocated for R&D purposes.
 

Ronen E

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Moderator
Ok. I should have been clearer. Without a typical owner. The ultimate ownership of DNV GL rests with a Foundation. All the profits are re-invested into the organization. DNV GL also has a policy of investing 5% of it’s annual revenue in R&D. For 2018, it means approximately US$ 125,000,000.00 were allocated for R&D purposes.
Thanks for clarifying.
NOT specifically addressing DNV GL (about which I don't know a lot), but rather in general:

- Who owns such a Foundation? If it's owned "by itself", isn't it equivalent with a cooperative?

- The word "ultimate" in "The ultimate ownership" tells me that this ownership is some sort of legal/accounting technicality. For me the interesting question is what happens in the practical (not technical/legal) sense - where is the free income parked before it's spent?

- If there are no profits (in the accounting sense), or the org is officially tagged non-profit, it doesn't mean that no one profits from the activity, and maybe even more than in a for-profit org, there's a chance that a large portion of the free income goes into the pockets of individuals on the org's payroll. That's a simple way to help ensure that there would be no accounting profit.

- R&D investment is mostly absorbed in the org itself (salaries for R&D personnel), and is otherwise just another input in the normal income-generation activity of most orgs above a certain size. I don't see it as especially noble. Other than these two aspects, the "human serving & advancement" aspect of R&D activity (if one is claimed to exist) is IMO mostly lip service towards the org's image, and it's also quite common that R&D spending is driven by government tax relief schemes. So, a big R&D spending figure in itself may be, IMO, more an indication of sound business management than an indication of the org's altruistic character.



To me, if an org survives for a very long time it simply indicates that maintaining the existence of that org has consistently been a goal prioritised over other goals (which, in itself, suggests that the org prioritises taking care of itself), and that the right decisions were consistently made (and implemented) to allow it. It tells me, directly, very little about whether that org is in effect promoting anything but it's own good. It may, indirectly, indicate that that org may be perceived as doing good beyond its boundaries because its long survival suggests that it motivates external parties to support it (promote its survival).
 

Watchcat

Trusted Information Resource
when an org is based on members, isn't serving the members' needs serving the org itself?

There is a difference between being based on members and being based on membership dues. Memberships are often like any other product or service. The amount the customer is willing to pay is based on the value they see in the product or service, and whether or not it is viable is determined by the difference between the cost to provide and the revenue generated by the provision. So a lot hinges on whether number of members x dues equal enough income to provide the value that members will pay for.

Often members aren't willing to pay much for membership per se, because membership per se has little value to them. They will pay more if membership offers benefits that have value to them. The catch is that the benefits they value often cost the organization money to deliver. This often leaves very little money left to actually serve the organization, i.e., to cover its basic management and operating costs.
 

Mike S.

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Saw this in a Quality Digest article today.... Competition for Risk Assessment Increases

"A second weakness relates to the professional societies. The IIA and IFAC are relatively stable. The same cannot be said ASQ. ASQ’s membership has been steadily declining. It has gone from approximately 135,000 in 1997 to 55,000 in 2020, with the 2020 ASQ budget anticipating continued decline."
 
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Ajit Basrur

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Saw this in a Quality Progress article today.... Competition for Risk Assessment Increases

"A second weakness relates to the professional societies. The IIA and IFAC are relatively stable. The same cannot be said ASQ. ASQ’s membership has been steadily declining. It has gone from approximately 135,000 in 1997 to 55,000 in 2020, with the 2020 ASQ budget anticipating continued decline."

You meant "QualityDigest"
 
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