Choosing a Registrar - Registrars That "Do It All"

Lucinda,
I think know the Registrar you are talking about. I have been using them for about two years and have NO complaints. We have been through the registration audit, three surveillance audits and the stage I & II EMS audit; each time with a different auditor from different ends of the country.
Not once have I been approached in an unethical manner for the sake of passing the audit, Nor have I been approached, at any time, to discuss consulting services.

Sam,

Respectfully,

Did you approve, hire, and pay the registrar?

How was the decision process to hire the registrar conducted?

Why is there a different auditor each time?

How many majors and minirs are found (average)?

I think we can all cut the **** and say Perry Johnson!

Al,

"Did you approve, hire, and pay the registrar?"
Yes

"How was the decision process to hire the registrar conducted?"
Telecon with other registrars, cost comparison.

"Why is there a different audit or each time?"
Don't know. Didn't ask. All auditors come from the same "Gene pool" and I haven't experienced any problems.
On this same subject, a registrar I had at another company had the same auditor for pre-ass, registration and surveillance. The one problem that I became concerned with is that he knew our system and began to act like a consultant rather then an auditor.

"How many majors and minirs are found (average)?"
Strange question, are you inferring that the number of majors and minors a registrar writes is evidence of his worthiness?

One major during pre-assessment, 18 minors during registration.


"I think we can all cut the **** and say Perry Johnson!"
I could name another. But then again we all have our own axe to grind.

Sam,

Thank you for your responses! The reason I was asking was for some future research I will be doing.

Thanks again

Go Sam!

Al D.

For punishment I enjoy breast stroking through a 50 yard swath of razor wire, topped off by rolling around in salt!

Sam,

You go Guy! No amount of registrar bashing would sway me from getting the optimum out of my potential Registrar. Conflicts of interest? So what? Who's judging? Opinions and lofty goals are free stuff. If you are totally satisfied and "Registered", you did a great job. If the name is who others are saying, this guy isn't cheap. So, you've spent plenty of cash and consider the money well spent. Isn't that Customer Satisfaction?

Sounds and looks like "line crossing to me". PJ may have been advisors to Arthur Anderson too!

Auditing & consulting the same client are (or at least should be) like oil and water.

I do a whole bunch of ISO 9000 & 14000 related public training courses for some very well know providers, and I tell the students that they would not see me on an audit team at their facility for at least 2 years if I were working for their Registrar also. I may be exceeding the RAB requirement, but I try to avoid that conflict of interest pitfall as much as possible.

I have no first-hand knowledge of Perry Johnson other than having received some marketing materials from them. I do remember meeting one fellow QM a year or so ago who said they used them and loved them -- hardly a statistically valid sampling, huh? However, after reading some of the scathing reviews on this thread I got curious. I wondered what a company could do to be so reviled! After all, according to their literature, they are currently accredited by the Registrar Accreditation Board (RAB), the Raad voor Accreditatie (RvA), the Japanese Accreditation Board (JAB), the United Kingdom Accreditation Service (UKAS), the Brazilian National Institute of Metrology (INMETRO), the German Association for Accreditation (TGA) and the Federal Motor Transport Authority of Dresden (KBA). And since 1995 they were the fastest-growing registrar in North America, and on ISO 9000 were #1 in new registrations in 1999, 2000, and 2001. Surely they must be satisfying someone!

Are all these customers just uninformed or is there something else here? I don't have the answers, but I always get curious when someone at or near the top gets such bad press -- it almost reminds me of Microsoft!

Randy said:


Auditing & consulting the same client are (or at least should be) like oil and water.

I do a whole bunch of ISO 9000 & 14000 related public training courses for some very well know providers, and I tell the students that they would not see me on an audit team at their facility for at least 2 years if I were working for their Registrar also. I may be exceeding the RAB requirement, but I try to avoid that conflict of interest pitfall as much as possible.

Click to expand...

Randy,

It sounds like your approach is to go out of your way to avoid any appearances of conflict of interest. That is admirable indeed. Do you suggest a change in the rules of the governing bodies?

By the way - neat avitar. Do you mind my asking what it is you're shooting? Are you a competitive shooter, hunter, military shooter, or just a plinker for fun? Either way -- how un-politically correct of you! Way to go!

Mike S,
Thanks for the research on PJR. I've also been curious as to why they are slammed so much.
PJR is our registrar and has been since 1998 for QS9000. They have always gone out of their way to satisfy our needs as a client. Both their internal and external auditors have conducted themselves proffessionally and above board. Closing meetings were well organized, in the PJR format, and NC's were understood before the auditor left.
Unfortunately, they did not make the cut for an ISO/TS 16949 CB.

Mike,

That's a 20 odd year old photo I decided to use for a bit. It was during my SWAT Team days. I was a Scout/Sniper in the Marines a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away. I shot in competition as a Marine and as a police officer for years. I never hunted our furry friends and haven't fired a weapon since '95.