How do you find your Internal Auditors?

I voted for the 2nd option - like most others it seems. I've had equally good success with auditors from production as with office staff. Really it just comes down to having the right aptitude to pick up the knowledge and skills. And a little thick skin doesn't hurt too much either...

Typically, we will ask someone we feel might fill the bill. We let them know that we expect a certification of some type (ASQ-CQA at minimum. Don't know if/how that satifies 19011, but that is our requirement) within a certain time frame (varies from person to person) and set up "measurement points" in their learning process to acheive the certification.

We have recently required that senior management perform internal audits. They have a nice checklist to go by and, hopefully, learn on their own (or asking "experienced" auditors) how to "probe" beyond the list. I believe it is an excersize to keep them in touch with reality (to date, they are doing much better than I thought they might ).

Bill

Bill,

Getting a AQC-CQA is not an easy task.

Are you saying that CQA is a minimum for potential internal auditors but not for management?

How many people have passed the CQA certification only to say I can make more mony someplace else?

I'm sure your not giving us the whole scoop, more info please?

Al...

The first change we made was to change the focus of our audits from groups of elements to departments, and upping our focus on conformance to procedures and work instructions. This made it much easier to get production personnel involved - it made sense to audit another department (preferably the one they just left) and go skeleton hunting!

Second, participation "above and beyond" is considered as part of employee evals, so it now goes further than "looking good on a resume" - if you want a better raise, you have to get involved.

Lastly, as business gets tight and overtime gets harder to come by, they come looking for me

Karen, who decides if the audit is a success?

Al...

I'm not sure what you mean by "success"...

Al,

Getting a AQC-CQA is not an easy task.

Click to expand...

IMO - The CQA is, hands down, the easiest of the ASQ certifications requiring recertification every 3 yrs.

Are you saying that CQA is a minimum for potential internal auditors but not for management?

Click to expand...

Basically, yes. I don't believe we require Senior Management personnel to achieve certification. As I mentioned, my feeling is that it is more of an excersize to keep them in touch with what really happens on the floor.

How many people have passed the CQA certification only to say I can make more mony someplace else?

Click to expand...

So far, we've only had one, full-time, auditor "test the waters". He's doing pretty well at his new employer (last I heard) but is not in the auditing function there.

Our internal auditing is not quite as informal as Karen's (BTY - Welcome Karen ) but her spin has put me to pondering if the approach she describes might not help make our audits more friendly to the various departments who still seem to view the audits as a police action. As far as the rest of the scoop, there really isn't anything. We have had some good things come out of our internal audits, but, as I said, they're mostly looked at as a "necessary evil".

Bill

Jim

I guess I don't understand your post (it's pretty early for me).

Which "top management shall" clause is being violated? I see our "new" requirement as positive in that "Top management" is now out on the floor a couple of times a month and gaining knowledge of precisely what is going on. Won't this help them make better decisions and improvements when reviewing company policies/procedures? I don't think I'm saying what I mean to say very well. Most of our "Tier II" documents (Corporate Procedures) were written by Senior Management (at least "fine tuned"). A few of those managers would have been hard pressed to find our Central Melt department. For someone to sit in the "Ivory Tower" and define company policy, with no idea of the impact to the floor, is, IMO, ludicrous. I'm thankful our CEO shares that view. Not only from the auditing standpoint, but the "hourlies" actually get to see, and have exchanges with, the people who run the company (a good thing????).

This is just "Step 1". They're on the floor. Maybe some day down the road they will be asked to become "certified" as they become more comfortable with the process. Maybe they will seek certification on their own (whoa!!!). It really wouldn't matter to me as a piece of paper stating "certified" has never implied that one is "good at it".

Not trying to start anything, just don't understand the jist of your post.

Bill

If it works

Well we differ on this one. I get Exec. involved where they need to be to answer the SHALLS. I keep them informed of what is going on. But for the most part, they have put the rest on me. They don't even show up at the Opening Meetings anymore. They'll be at the Closing Meeting and they will make themselves available when needed for the audit. Here is what is in our Operations Manual as a portion of my responsiblities:

The Quality Systems Manager is responsible for:
Integration and Overseeing the Quality System & Procedures, Reviews Production/Process Control Data, Problem Solving Methodology Training, lSO, TE and QS-9000 Requirements and QOS Principles, Vendor Source Surveillance, Lead Auditor and Auditor Training, Management Representative responsibilities, Provide Counsel to the President.

Exec is responsible for setting our company goals (our Hoshin). These goals drive the system and is our business plan. They hold 2 meetings with the entire company each year, 1st quarter and 4th quarter. One to roll 'em out and the other to give us our company report card. It works for us.

Randy

Are you differing with me?

If so, I don't see the "differing". Our executives also have the responsiblities for "steering the ship", but have decided (or had decided for them ) to add the floor auditing process to their "Job Description" (for lack of a better term).

Our "Systems" person also has the same responsibilities as you have listed. Her job has just been made easier because now the execs actually look at the QMS and ask "better" (more informed)questions and actually have a "stake" in what we say we are doing.

Just a different means to achieve the desired outcome(s) (that line should give me BINGO! ).

Bill